Friday, May 30, 2008

Shidduch Making/Dating Part 2

In recent news the ‘shidduch crisis’ is on everyone’s blogs again. Everyone is thinking about the problem and thinking of possible ways of evading the problems that are bound to come up in the future.
Part of the problem in my humble opinion is: people don’t know how frum to be. They are crazy with the amount of issues laid upon them. They don’t know weather to pay a girl a compliment, or weather or not the girl should bring examples of torah in conversation. These issues are just so interesting to everyone around them. For the boy he doesn’t know weather to sit or stand or jump, the girl, pretty much the same thing. Why did all of this start? Where are all of these issues coming from? Why is it important if a girls family collects plates at the table or weather or not takes them into the kitchen one by one? In my opinion some simplified questions/statements can be used. Some of the questions include: Have you ever had premarital sex? In your opinion is paying taxes right or wrong? Clarify upon your previous answer of tax paying with why you feel the way you do? Do you feel illegal immigrants help or hurt the countries economy? Do you feel there is anything wrong with having illegal immigrants work for a large company, get paid very little, work in sub human conditions in order for the large company to profit lots of money is okay as long as none of the illegal immigrants are Jewish?
The above questions are a true representation of what questions should be phrased as in order to really understand the person and if they are good people or just wolves in sheep’s clothing.

4 comments:

Orthonomics said...

I like your questions :).
I'd say one of the basic goals of "going out" should be to establish the character of a person and if their worldview is similiar to that of your own. Questions like yours are best dealt with face to fact in a non-scripted method on a date.

Whether or not they stack dishes at the table says little about their personality. Housekeeping issues can be dealt with in marriage. Finding out your spouse has little integrity or that your world view is miles apart is a lot more difficult to rectify, if it can be rectified.

Mighty Garnel Ironheart said...

The problem with dating, at least in the first few weeks/months is that everybody puts on their best behaviour. The guy wears a nice suit, the girl does herself up and both do whatever they can to impress the other while quietly scanning to see if they can get a glimpse into their date's true character.
Forget questions about taxes and global warming. Hold a date on a day when one of the two is having a migraine. Or right after one of them has tanked an exam, or lost a job. Or is under any other kind of stress. Any two people can have a great time when they're both feeling great and doing great. The marriages that stand the test of time are the ones in which the partners can give of themselves when everything isn't sunshine and roses.

wrpn said...

Well first of all I'm not sure why one's views on premarital sex would be a make or breaker. Like a lot of Modern Orthodox Jews I had lost virginity, in a committed relationship with a liked minded observant woman, before I was married. I was very open about this with the person I eventually married. Furthermore, I'm willing to bet that many of the married couples, in quite a few of the leading Orthodox Batei Knessot in my city, were initimate with each other, or others, being they were married. Let's not be so harsh or judgmental about people.

Chew and shred said...

There's a mathematical reason:
We are living in a time of (thank God) peace and wealth (ok, so we're living on last generations successes somewhat). In these times, we are propagating. So, there twice as many boys and girls every year. Assume there is a 50-50 spread of boys to girls born every year. Now, most jewish men will marry girls 1-4 years younger. So, for each 24 year old boy born in 1984, there is 1 girl born the same year, two girls born the year before in 1985(21yrs old), three in 1986 (22yrs) etc. So, a 3 year gap means there is 1boy:3girls. So now, that boy is married, and the other 2 girls are left. And, older girls, even fewer boys are left. See it?

This plates/white tablecloth/family yichus/who your father knows/ thing, comes from dense wealthy Jewish communities. When you feel you are the cream of the crop, as your mother taught you, and you do things the way that they SHOULD be done, you will want to check that your potential mate's standards, history, family development etc. are up to your standards. In a dense community, sometimes opinions or philosophies are so ingrained, no one discusses them! Like, "do you believe in God? Do you think our religious system is pretty good? What mores are important to pass to your kids?" well um, DUH, why else would I be in this community? We assume jews = integrity - and the same integrity as mine. So the bases are covered by the fact that we are IN the community.

The truth is, this model does NOT apply anymore. The women who are unable to find shidduchim are usually a cut above.

I like the chaos model of dating: go out on a bad day.